Have you ever felt like a chameleon, blending into the background of different cultures and communities? That's a reality for many within the Oromo culture, as we unpack in this episode.
Childhood experiences can be like invisible threads, guiding our adult relationships and self-perceptions in ways we often don't realize. We explore these profound influences in this episode, delving into how memories of inclusion or exclusion can shape our interactions and even our tendency to please others at the expense of ourselves.
It's a candid look at the pressures of family expectations, the emotional toll of people-pleasing, and the delicate dance of growing up without losing oneself along the way. As we peel back the layers, we uncover the critical importance of setting boundaries and the cultural nuances that complicate this process.
Visit our IG page at https://www.instagram.com/dc_overcoffee/ to join the conversation!
Have you ever felt like a chameleon, blending into the background of different cultures and communities? That's a reality for many within the Oromo culture, as we unpack in this episode.
Childhood experiences can be like invisible threads, guiding our adult relationships and self-perceptions in ways we often don't realize. We explore these profound influences in this episode, delving into how memories of inclusion or exclusion can shape our interactions and even our tendency to please others at the expense of ourselves.
It's a candid look at the pressures of family expectations, the emotional toll of people-pleasing, and the delicate dance of growing up without losing oneself along the way. As we peel back the layers, we uncover the critical importance of setting boundaries and the cultural nuances that complicate this process.
Visit our IG page at https://www.instagram.com/dc_overcoffee/ to join the conversation!
As-salamu alaykum, welcome to Difficult Conversations where we tackle taboo topics in a safe space through empowerment and education. The information on this podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be considered professional mental health advice. I think I really want to get into kind of Oromos as a group and our chameleon tendencies Before we get started. I think one of the reasons why I want to talk about this is for the longest I was working with this with an Oromos sister for like I think six months or so, and she was like I thought she was Somali, she thought I was Somali, and this whole six months we were like I don't know, not not really unsure of each other, um, and then finally I don't know what it was, I think I was on the phone, uh, with my mom or something.
Speaker 1:I was talking to Oromo and and then she's like oh, wow, wow, oromoda, and I was like, yeah, you know, and I think this happens to me personally a lot and I and I've always wondered like why that is the case and why we tend to I guess I mean, for lack of a better word our chameleons whenever we get ourselves into situations, whether it's like when we're around somalis or when we're around um other ethiopians. We just kind of blend in and it's just our nature a lot of the times, um, we don't like to rock the boat, we don't like to uh, challenge status quo, um. So I really like just want to talk about that and how that affects you personally in the workspace, how that affects you in relationships and in like every dynamic of life. So yeah.
Speaker 1:What do you guys think about that?
Speaker 2:I'm actually curious why don't you ask her Like are you Odom or Somali?
Speaker 1:I don't because I feel like I don't know, like because a lot of the time people always assume I'm Somali and. I get really like.
Speaker 1:I'm just like no, I'm not, you know and and I don't want to do that to anybody, okay you don't want to offend yeah, I didn't want not necessarily offended, because I don't think, I don't know, I don't know what it was, but I was just like, oh, maybe she's not like I just, but I do say, you know okay that's really interesting, because I mean, for me I wouldn't, kind of I would ask, uh, first and foremost, and whether, first of all, I'm always assumed that I'm Somali too.
Speaker 2:Um, when that happens, it's like they get really offended that I'm not yeah, but I and then the aspect of like when we just kind of assimilate in a background, yeah, related to our people.
Speaker 2:I feel like historically, before we even get into that, I wanted to kind of assimilate in a background related to our people. I feel like historically, before we even get into that, I wanted to kind of make a disclaimer a little bit about how the conversation that we may have today might be triggering for some people. We're going to talk about people pleasing and what that means collectively and individually and how that affects us. So if any of this topic is feeling very triggering, please take a step back and kind of take care of yourself, so that way that you are kind of meeting your needs in this conversation. But I think, historically our people, I would say is because we have been always the servant right, we were told to be a certain way in the land of the country that we're from, we're supposed to behave a certain way and even when it comes to conflict arising, general conflict, now I'm talking about outside of you know, family dynamic, but outside in the community, like the global collective.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:And, for example, like we're the first time Oromo people can only speak their language in Ethiopia freely, without no restriction. Behind it was 1990s, right? So before that you also can't speak Oromo. So if that aspect of the general background is that, how do you think internal inside the house conversation is going to be like when it comes to the way you're raised? Don't talk like this, don't talk outside like this, don't say this, don't walk like this, don't behave like this, because if you do, you're going to get in trouble by the actual government, the system, whatever you may call. So then parent whatever generation, historical and then parent whatever generation, historical trauma, psychological stuff. They raise all their kids to just not challenge the status quo, not to challenge where you're from, even if you can't even tell people you're Oromo, because there is that fear there still, even though there are, like younger generation Oromos, like so proud, so freely they can say it like I'm Oromo, I'm this, I you know, I love that.
Speaker 2:But for if you ask your older siblings, they're a little bit shy about the way they like present that the way that they talk about it the way they even like in conversation at work, for example, they intend to kind of hide behind the scenes and just allow everything to take place. And so because of that historical experiences I can always relate it to trauma and we intend to just avoid not wanting to be the center of attention, like I don't want to be. I don't want people to notice me, so I want to hide a little bit.
Speaker 3:So, yeah.
Speaker 3:No, I I was listening to you both. No, I was listening to you both and a couple of things was kind of going in and out of my brain. One was like the concept of the historical concept of how Odomo people, specifically, have been forced into chameleonism, almost right. Forced into chameleonism almost right, like, because you are told not to speak your language, you are told that, um, you were inferior, you were, you know, and even like the being cool is like being amara, right, like speaking amara, oh, she speaks. And even when you speak amara as a normal person and if you have an accent, you're called gala, yes, right, oh, she's so far like whatever, whatever, especially not these. But when I was back home I remember you know people, not, not, this is not necessarily just for ormo people, for even other tribes that are um speak. When they are speaking amharic and they speak it, even they're speaking it fluently. Just, they have an accent of their culture.
Speaker 3:They are considered she doesn't know very, you know she's not cool she's whatever so you are forced into chameleonism and then that comes, and then your parents and your family wanting you to be better, to be successful. It's basically like the in in america if you bring you here, it's code switching right yes being able to put like, if you are a black person, you speak in a speaking slang and or you have a certain dialect that you speak in, then you code, switch into this professionalism right?
Speaker 3:professional language, professional way of speaking that is technically um eurocentric right so you speak in a way that is monotone, that is like you know deeper, and you speak. You choose your diction well and whatever the case might be, so that you can remove yourself as far from who you are to meet their needs.
Speaker 3:So, and this happens to everyone that has been oppressed in any way at any point by anybody, yeah, right this is not just an autumnal phenomenon, but when it comes to us and in our culture, we also speak about, um, it's very. Take this concept of chameleonism and then bring it to a collective culture that cares so much about what the community thinks of them, right so? And then, when the community is an oppressive community, right, and I say that like, if the way you talk is to be, uh, demure, right, like if you're a girl, you have to be demure, you have to speak in a way that's like soft, you have to be seen but not heard yeah kind of thing very um.
Speaker 3:And then also, if you are expressive, if you are, and then you are balagay like, oh, I don't know, why are you getting into? You know people's like adult people's business yeah so consistently. Since childhood, you're told to be in the background yeah, being. You're taught that being in the background, hiding your voice, lowering your voice, um, not having an opinion is is the way to be a good girl, or a good guy, or not a good guy, but a good girl mostly golden boy, golden voice, right, oh he's.
Speaker 3:So mashallah he's. He doesn't have any trouble.
Speaker 1:So that creates this people pleasing chameleon syndrome where and I think like especially in um the workspace, right when you're trying to succeed here in the states that almost it's like those two things don't work.
Speaker 1:You know, like we're in the workplace, even just when it comes to um the rate, or like asking for a higher raise or something like that. I don't, I think that's something so, so uncomfortable for us. You know what I mean? Yeah, because you don't feel like you you're owed this thing, yeah, you know, and it's like and you don't want to rock the boat and whatever you're you're given, you're like okay, yeah, thank you, or whatever.
Speaker 3:Yeah, being grateful and you know, anecdotally, like for me, I remember when I was I think I was like in college or maybe even like senior in high school um, I had like a couple of projects that I was doing and I was consistently told not to promote them, like, let other people talk about you, don't talk about you, right?
Speaker 3:like, don't talk about the things that you're doing, let other people talk about you. Don't talk about you, right? Like, don't talk about the things that you're doing, let other people talk about the things that you're doing, and but you're like but I want people to come, I want people to you know, like, yeah and and that's considered like if you talk about yourself, you're being braggadocious yeah, uh if you promote yourself, you're, and there it's, it holds us.
Speaker 1:From a society that's built on that. That's built on that Even eye contact. Think about that.
Speaker 3:If you look at your adult, or if you look at a person that's like older than you in the eye, it's considered disrespectful. And then here, if you don't look at somebody, you're considered um cowardly right so, and if you don't ask for because they're not going to give you, yeah, what you're worth, you have to ask for it, you have to demand it.
Speaker 3:You have to be, and then, if you are not, someone that's like, hey, this is what I'm doing he did. You see my work. You know like I, I'm the one that's leading this project, I'm the one then they know everybody's willing to jump in and take the credit.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know what I mean and you're gonna be left behind and I think even in the aspect of interpersonal relationship, like friendship and even um partnership, with the ways that people pleasing even that shows up first and foremost. You sometimes people pleasing aspect doesn't even have to be told to you. You can become a people pleaser by based on observation of what the way your parents interact with other people. One example that I have is that the way that in our community is how one of your parents would be so stressed out of the way the community think of their children versus the safety of their children, right, for example, like they will take the side of like their friend comments over, like your comments, like I didn't say this, and your mom would be like, yes, you did, because blah, blah, blah Person's told me you did.
Speaker 2:Right, the trust is outside of the household than it is inside the household and that affect children. That distance and barriers between the mother and daughter relationship and father and son relationship, because father is always thinking so much about other people versus it is and children then intend to kind of, you know, behave that way when it comes to relationship, friendship, for example. What causes a people pleasing is that sometimes we are mold to behave a certain way and that contributes to fear of rejection, fear of abandonment, fear of, even, like, disappointing people, right, even in friendship. Like I don't want to bring it up, this conflict that happened between me and you, because if I do, maybe she's going to leave me, maybe this friendship is going to.
Speaker 1:So instead, I'm just gonna keep suppressing, repressing my feelings and so that way that I don't have to disrupt the peace or, you know, be confrontational, yeah, and I think I think for me, like I raising daughters, I really have to be mindful of that and just like when my daughter comes to me and she's like oh, oh, this happened at school, you know so and so doesn't like me, and stuff like that.
Speaker 1:But it's so hard to kind of get out of that mode, especially if you've been raised with that, right, if you've been raised with like OK, this is what you're supposed to do, this is what you know being a good girl is, and stuff like that. So it's definitely takes a lot of work to hold yourself back and it's like OK, what does this girl need at this moment? You know she needs me to listen, she needs me to validate her and she needs me to maybe like, try to push her in a direction that she does Like her friends don't have to like her, I mean, granted, she's in kindergarten, right, but the drama that goes on in kindergarten.
Speaker 2:But, it's real, yeah, it's real. The drama that goes on in kindergarten, but it's real. Yeah, it's real. Wallahi is real. And trust me, Wallahi, I'm telling you me as a therapist. Listening to the stories, people remember what happened in their kindergarten. People remember as a or how they felt, yes, how they felt and how that person made them feel, how the relationship with everybody stemmed from that experiences, how the relationship with everybody stemmed from that experiences. And now when they talk about relationship, friendship in general, they're like, yeah, I remember when I was in first grade, this person said X, Y and Z to me and I remember how I was so exclusive out of you know, being playing together or sitting at a lunch table together. And they talk about it as an adult in their 30s and 40s. This experience just continues to affect them.
Speaker 1:Right, because I don't know. When she tells, honestly, I will say, when she tells me these stories, I'm like OK, in my head, I'm like did that really happen? Or you know, or like are you, are you thinking about it? You know?
Speaker 2:I'm curious.
Speaker 3:Why do you not believe it? Are you saying are you saying more of like? Is it more in your head or did?
Speaker 1:it really happen. Is that what you're?
Speaker 3:saying no, I don't say that to her, but I mean I'm thinking, yeah, I'm thinking about it.
Speaker 1:I'm like, okay, did that really happen? Did she really like push you and you know, tell the teacher and like you know, she's like she's constantly telling us supposedly this girl their best friends.
Speaker 3:I don't know yeah, and you know, I kind of wanted to touch up a little bit on how you know. We are kind of told like oh, this, this family, you know, your cousins or your, your relatives, what is it called? Your mom's friends, their kids, are doing this and this right. And then you're like for me, specifically when, when we're just the idea of people pleasing and how your family, your family, tends to mirror like their friends, and they kind of believe that or they put that, they put that on you. Sometimes, like I say this to everyone that I've kind of known, I got out, I got. I didn't get to be a teenager because I was so scared of like.
Speaker 3:So, when I was a kid, when I was like in, actually when I was like in fifth grade, sixth grade, these kids, these um group of girls that were in a different part of the city, that were at that time in high school, okay, ended up like starting to date guys and they were dating guys and they kind of ran away with guys, whatever. And then my family heard about that and then all of a sudden, me, a sixth grader that has no, like, no desire to date anybody or talk to any guy, whatever the case is, I was being told like, oh, you wouldn't be balage like them, huh, if I literally don't wash the dishes, I'm like, oh, you're trying to turn into them, huh. And then now I went into from that, like from just being like, okay, cool, I can be friends with guys and it's cool. No problem to don't talk to me. I don't want you know like I'm like I don't want anyone to look at me. Don't talk to me.
Speaker 3:If you're a guy, don't come 10 feet of me, because I'm like I don't want to. You know, I don't want you to say I'm turning into them. Yeah, you know, and it kind of hint like that's one example. But like, if you're being told about these things, like if that's about what the way you eat, that's the way you interact with people, if that's the way, about the way you know you make friends, if that's like even the way your thought process oh, why do you think like that then you will go out of your way as a child to please your parents, to please your family or to not be what they don't want you to be.
Speaker 3:And then you kind of lose what you could have been.
Speaker 1:Right yeah.
Speaker 3:Because there's no room for error, there's no room for experiment in that culture of like. Anyway.
Speaker 2:I think another aspect of people pleasing a lot of people kind of don't understand is that emotional reading, like you know how you read the temperature. You're walking on eggshells. You're making sure that the person is not mad at you. You're like, oh, I read that person very well. No, you don't. You are somehow surviving so that you don't feel like you're not disturbing the peace.
Speaker 1:You do read people.
Speaker 2:You do read them, you, you read, but I'm saying like emotional read, like oh, I know when they're mad, I know when they're sad, like that's a lot of emotional labor that you're doing in order for you to feel safe. Yeah, does that make sense because, that's your survival
Speaker 2:apparatus, yeah, but then you get really good at that though you do, but what I'm saying is that it's not something to be celebrated. You did it to survive. Does that make sense? You did it because the environment that you're in you have to please. If you don't please, everything is going to harm you. You're going to get in trouble, yeah, but it's a superpower.
Speaker 3:It's a superpower you gain through trauma. It is.
Speaker 2:But at the same time I think it's not something to be celebrated to teach your children to do those things, because just because you survived that environment to kind of read every the room temperature every single time you walked in, it doesn't mean that you have to keep doing it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I will say, though, like that allows you to be a little bit like empathetic.
Speaker 2:You know you can be empathetic, but you don't have to carry anybody else's emotional labor.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but, but then I feel like there is a balance that you can have.
Speaker 2:You know, you can.
Speaker 1:You can, you can.
Speaker 3:You can do that.
Speaker 3:What we're saying are the type of room reading and body language reading that we're talking about is that like, for example, for kids that have really really strict parents, that you know they actually get kundutas or not, like not very harsh kundutas and like you know all that I don't want to say you know but, um, they tend to come into the room especially if their parents go off the hinges, off of like little things, and be like, okay, what's coming, what's expecting me when I walk in the house, right, so they come in and they see their mom's body language or their dad's body language, especially like kids that have um parents that either are that drink or you know parents that are you know whatever, have anger issues.
Speaker 1:They come and they're reading the mom's twitch yeah, dad's like I think I think some of that, too, is like it can it can be due to just their I'm like, just their personality too, because, when comparing, like my two daughters right, my oldest she's really good at like she know, she, I don't know she's she's really good at sensing and like reading people and like she's very helpful around the house and like she's caring for my little. You know, the youngest son, but my middle girl, she I'll be like, hey, fatou, can you please? You know, grab me something. She's like no, I don't want to do that right now, yeah, you know.
Speaker 1:So I think it also they're both healthy, though I think, yeah, they're both healthy, but but I'm saying it's not, it's not all the time that it's a response of like trauma, trauma, no yes, but there's this, no, no, hold on hold on, let me, let me just explain. There's a difference.
Speaker 3:There's a difference. Um, for example, for me, nafi, if she sees, like she knows, me being bubbly and happy and like playing with her, and if she sees me a little serious of my body language and it has nothing to do with her, she knows that whatever I'm feeling, whatever, and she comes, she's like mommy, are you okay? And she comes and she feels that, she reads the room and she tries to make me feel better.
Speaker 2:To make sure that's safe for her to come talk to you.
Speaker 3:It's not about safe for her In this situation, you. It's not about safe for her in this situation. It's not about safe for her. She knows she's she. Because in that same moment, if I tell her now, if you go do this, she'll more she'll, she can, she wants, if she doesn't want to do it, she'll say no. She knows that's not going to get directed at her. You know what I mean. Yeah, she'll be like how she's two years old. Let me explain. Let me explain.
Speaker 3:So, basically, ahun, for example, I'm sad right and me and her, we just had a, we just played she's. My energy towards her is normal. Even when she approached me, I am like welcoming her with the same like hi, how are you? But she knows something is different. She knows, like, if I'm sad, she knows it's not about her. She knows when it's about her, she knows. You know, it's just an instinctual thing. So if I say like she comes in and she says, hey, mommy, are you OK, I want me to kiss, and then she kisses me and then she goes, she, she leaves, she just wants to make me feel better, and then she leaves. And then there are days when she's like she does something, for example, she does something and she sees my face reaction like you're not supposed to do that.
Speaker 3:She comes and then she goes sorry, mommy, and then she gives me a kiss and then she leaves. But that's like there's a difference of like being able to read the room and like feel your feelings and then respond like is this a threat to me or is? Are you just going like I was, like I was just listening to um, the body keeps the score on the audio and he was talking about like how babies, can he, like a baby can read them. Like an infant, a newborn baby, can read the mom's emotion? Like he was talking about how the baby like pulled the mom's hair and like he saw like her cringe and like and then put like it's an instinctual, like 12 second thing, like put a hand over his face, you know, and put it down when she started smiling again, that wasn't. I don't think that baby is interpreting like this mom that has never been violent to me is going to be violent to me. It's more of like feeling like something is off here. You know what I?
Speaker 1:mean Something is different here.
Speaker 3:Right and it has more so, like that's what. I think there is a healthy level of reading a room and making sure you're okay. That's kind of being sympathetic and empathetic. I think there's a healthy level of fear too. And Yusuf, for example, he's cool, he can come around, he sees me, mommy, you okay, cool, goes out, he doesn't sit.
Speaker 2:My thing is that I wonder the things that you feel might be helpful for your child to do with you, and Things that you feel might be helpful for your child to do with you, and what would that look like for them in surviving the real world. Those behaviors that they are so good about right now with you are some is going to be an environment of other people who are not as emotionally safe as you are to them. How does that? How would you, as a parent, distinguish that level of parenting, saying love, the fact that you do this? I also want you have the autonomy to do the things to say no, like fatay said, yeah, and I think that's that's my biggest issue, like, not issue.
Speaker 1:But my biggest worry when it comes to my oldest is that, like, she's like very giving and very like helpful to me and others and stuff like that. But then, like, like, for example, one of our friends came over and then she, she had this jacket that she really she liked, you know. And then I could just see it play out where, like the girl, she's like oh, I think you know this looks, this looks, dia wanted the jacket, you know. And then the other girl was like oh, oh, I don't think it looks good on you. And and then Dia's like oh, do you want to wear it? Then and she's like yeah, let me wear it. Then she wore it, you know.
Speaker 1:So then I was just like, and I had to really like, hold myself back and also because I then afterwards I said hey, dia, you know that wasn't okay. Like you, you know you like the jacket, you know. So why did you like give it to her, you know? But then, at the same time, I was talking to one of my sisters, uh, about it, and she's like but isn't that hot? Like, is it basically? She basically said isn't that how you're raising her?
Speaker 3:like to be a good person in the world there's a distinction, though, is being a good person in the world, being wanting to give something versus wanting to give because you don't want confrontation.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know what I mean. I think she should be comfortable.
Speaker 3:She should be comfortable being confrontational.
Speaker 1:This is mine. I like this.
Speaker 3:And then if she wants to give her and she's like, oh, I like this, but if you want to wear it, you can wear it, that's fine. You know what I mean? Yeah.
Speaker 2:I think that's what you mean about balance.
Speaker 2:The balance is what Bonnie's saying and what you're thinking Like being giving, being able to understand situations and having being able to understand, or when are you doing it out of a fear? Out of a fear of like you don't want? For example, when I talked about the parent aspect of it, there was an example that recently somebody a client, was telling me that when they were a child, they had to really pay attention to their parents. When they come home from work, they read their faces. This is not the parent that drinks, this is not the parent that has anything to do, but this is just their parent.
Speaker 2:If their mom's face looked different than the way, just the tone of her voice, they know when to run to hide in their room, right? So it's like that's emotional reading. It's like, okay, I can read my mom and being aware of like, oh, she's mad today, she had a hard day today. So mom cannot be able to express her frustration, her difficulty at work. But what does she do when she come home? Why is the house not clean? What are you doing? You're lazy, you haven't done anything the whole day. So now the kid has to read the emotion. Either they go clean so mom doesn't yell at them or they go hide in their room.
Speaker 2:That's what I mean when I say emotional reading is like now that child is going to be doing that as an adult to their partners, to their friends, to make sure, like, oh, my friend, when she responded to me, something was off today. So every single time, like they're always on an edge with, like feeling hypervigilant about, like wait, I should have said something. Maybe I should have talked to my friend a little bit longer, because all of that laboring that person is doing, it's not healthy to them, right? If you do it out of a care, knowing that it's not having such a severe impact on you, that's fine. But if it's having severe physical impact and you're always afraid that you're going to disappoint one of your friend, one of your partner, or one of whoever might be, is that's not good for you.
Speaker 1:So then, what do you suggest then?
Speaker 3:I feel like, because right now, I think it's consistency, you see, for kids. When Dahabi was talking about that, I can definitely relate to that in the sense that if you don't know for growing up, if you don't know what sets someone off right, like, oh, if I, if I clean, if I, you know, take like whatever, like you have, towards any child, like, even in a healthy household, if I have, if I do my chores, if I do my homework, if I have good grades, if I'm a good like, if I am a polite, like, good child, normally I don't have any consequences, right. And then if I do get these consequences, I know exactly what the consequences are going to be. My parents have been consistent about my expectation and what's expected of me and the consequences if I don't meet those expectations. But if you walk in in a family that's unhealthy and toxic or in the situations that create people pleasers or people room readers and body language readers, kids are always walking into a situation where they don't know what they're walking into.
Speaker 3:Like, oh, I did the dishes, I have good grades, I have this, I have that, I'm doing what I'm supposed to do, but something in the parents the goalposts yeah, the goalposts changes and then something, even that doesn't have anything to do with them, there's something that they don't have any control over, will impact them and they will have consequence for something that they didn't even do. For example, they might have done everything that they're supposed to do, but the parent might have had a very bad day at work. But they don't know how to emotionally regulate themselves, so they normally take it out on the kids. So when they come into the house they're like how's mom feeling today? And then to know that maybe before the hits come or before the insults come, the mom maybe like does the miranda personally of like you know, like you know, purses her lips or like she squints and looks at them, whatever the case is, or she's storming around the house grunting, then they know what to expect right
Speaker 3:and then they know how to navigate that. Um, so it's more about the consistency of it. Like, okay, if I do this, I do this, and if this that comes for this is this and it's known, it's consistent, then that's healthy. So they don't have this anxiousness of like, what am I walking into, what am I supposed to do? You know what? What is mom dealing with? What's dad dealing with it? You know, even if they know, if their parents had a bad day at work or someone crossed them or they have whatever, they know, that's not gonna be about them yeah, you know, yeah, and I think I'm sure you asked a really good question.
Speaker 2:Thank you, bonnie, for that. You also asked a good question how do we help? What are we supposed to do in this situation? Yeah, one is to just acknowledge that you are doing it, right, that's one. Secondly, you have to realize that nothing is really your fault, right, you're not in trouble, right?
Speaker 2:Another aspect of that is that realizing that you need to set boundaries with people, whether whoever that might be, is like, whether it's your family, whether it's your friends. Set boundaries with yourself and with them, saying like, if I'm not able to meet at nine o'clock, I can't meet at nine o'clock. Can we meet at 830 or seven o'clock, right? And then also identifying what is a priority for you. What do you feel like in your body when something comes up? Do you feel like you're scared? Do you feel like you're going back to that little part of you that started the first time?
Speaker 2:Notice what's coming up for you in the process when somebody is asking you to do it and then you have to set limits, with yourself, saying that this feels uncomfortable for me and I don't know how to talk to this person. So what do I need to do about this. I need to talk to someone that I feel comfortable with, right, and who makes me feel safe when I express myself, that I'm not getting in trouble with, who makes me realize that, ok, here's what's happening and this is what you could do. And if the person say, you know, I am not ready to do this by myself, would you like me to come with you? Ok, sure, let's do it together. I'll just be there for you while you talk to this person, right? Those are the things. Another part is like teaching kids early on. That is OK for people not to like you, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Right, it's okay for people to feel uncomfortable with you. If you like something, you like something. But if you want to be generous and give to that person, go ahead, do so.
Speaker 1:But you don't have to compromise yourself in order for the world to be happy with you, and I think, to just to wrap up, you know our conversation we started off with talking about Oromos as a collective, how we are constantly people pleasing just to fit in, to not rock the boat, and that, I feel like, is a big point in terms of not caring whether people like you or not.
Speaker 1:I think we'll solve a lot of our problems, you know, in terms of you know, if you want to get that promotion at work, if you want to move, if you want to start a business, if you want to um, have goals for this year, um, not taking people into consideration, cause I think, growing up, that was always the biggest thing and it's it was. It has always been forefront. You know the biggest thing and it's it was. It has always been forefront, you know. You know, um. And just to wrap up, I think you made some really good points about what are some things that you can do to combat that, but personally, I think you know it's hard to go and say, okay, let's change how Ormos think as a whole, right, but you as a person as a whole, right, but you as a person you as Bonnie, me and Dabe I think what's one thing that you will do in your life not somebody else, because I think this affects us collectively, right?
Speaker 2:Yes For me. I've been working on this for a while, since I think working on becoming, on learning a lot of people, policing and dentistry takes a lot of life work and it's not going to be done in one tips that we're giving. One of the things that I realized is that if the person doesn't tell me what I have done to them, I am not responsible for their emotions. I am not responsible for how you're feeling about me and I'm not going to read the room and trying to do your emotional laboring for you, and I'm OK with that. I'm OK with the fact that you're going to leave or you're going to reject me. I'm OK with that because I have to understand the impact its physical impact that it has on me. So I mean, it's something that I've. It's related to boundaries too, so I use boundaries as well and I'm kind of very like religious about my boundaries, a lot of it. So I'm like if I can't do it, I can't do it. No, yeah.
Speaker 1:How about you, Bonnie?
Speaker 3:I feel like the habit is in a little bit further on the spectrum the journey than I am.
Speaker 1:She's almost out of it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, definitely. She's almost out of it. Yeah, yeah, definitely. For me, I think it's about finding my anchor and kind of trusting myself in my own body, in the sense that, like normally, if someone asks me to do something, I my instinct is how can I make? How can I make it work, instead of like how? What's taking what? What is it taking from me to make it work? Right?
Speaker 3:like so, if so, what I do and what I'm learning to do is kind of being anchoring myself and being like okay, you, I, I know you want to say, yes, I know you want that person to be satisfied and happy with you and you want to be, you know, whatever.
Speaker 3:But then you have to be able to say how does this make you feel like, are you doing this because you want to do this or are you doing this because you want that person to like you, to be happy with you, and all of those things? So, and if the answer is just taking that time, because I'm still in that practice of it like it, if it's not natural for me, like you know, or it's you're not, like it's not as religious for me as it is for Dahabay, like I'm not there yet, so every time I have to ask myself are you doing this because you want to do this? Are you doing this for the sake of Allah, or are you doing this because you want to make that person happy and you want to um that person to like you and to be happy with you?
Speaker 1:okay, I think, for me, um, like, I think my biggest thing has been just being me, you know, authentically, all the time, because I feel like a lot of people will be like, oh, she's so quiet, blah, blah, reserved, um, it's okay, right, and I think it's more likely than not it's because I don't let people in because of fear of rejection, um, and so I think that's mostly what I've been working on is just like not really trying not to care, um, and just being me in terms of, like, decision making, um, and just doing things and moving in a way that I feel like I'm pleased with versus the next person.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so yep and so, yeah, um, I think this is really a great conversation, ladies. I really do enjoyed every single thought that came up. Um, we'll continue to talk about this, and this has been a difficult conversation see you next time join the conversation in the comment section or on our social media pages.
Speaker 1:We do not have all the answers, and our biggest goal is to kick off the conversation and get it started. May Allah accept our efforts and use us for catalysts of change.