Difficult Conversations
Difficult Conversations
Parenting and Emotional Resilience
In this episode, we discuss the profound impact of our childhood experiences on our parenting styles while exploring emotional intelligence and regulation. The conversation highlights the importance of fostering a safe environment for children to express their feelings while reflecting on how our own upbringing shapes our actions as parents.
• Engaging personal stories about children's emotional intelligence
• Exploring how generational parenting influences current styles
• Importance of emotional regulation for parents
• Recognizing scarcity mindset and shifting towards abundance
• The power of sharing vulnerabilities in parenting
• Creating a safe space for children to express feelings
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Assalamu alaikum, Welcome to Difficult Conversations where we tackle taboo topics in a safe space through empowerment and education.
Speaker 2:Hi, assalamu alaikum, how are you two doing today? Welcome back to season four, ladies.
Speaker 3:Welcome back. How are you guys? Are you guys excited for season four?
Speaker 2:I'm very excited.
Speaker 1:Me too. It's good to be back in the studio and recording. Yes, it's been a while.
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely. Well, my name is Dahabe. I am here to just talk about everything mental health, emotional health, physical health and ways that we can kind of improve our life, and that's what I'm going to be here talking a lot about and you'll hear a lot of it. So yeah, that's me.
Speaker 1:I'm Abshiro. I'm in healthcare by background and I'm really excited for the season.
Speaker 3:I am Bonnie and I am also in healthcare, but more in the administration side for background, and I'm also a life coach. More in the administration side for background and I'm also a life coach, and I'm really excited to talk to you guys this season.
Speaker 2:So, ladies, this season we're going to be focusing on a new, brand new episode of Seasons. Overall, we're going to be talking about parent mental health and kind of giving our audience a little bit overview of what our discussion is going to be. And kind of giving our audience a little bit overview of what our discussion is going to be and kind of addressing the complicity around being, you know, parenting and navigating different things that comes along with that, and so kind of providing talking about our own experiences growing up, talking about how two of you are a parent and how you guys are navigating those experiences and being also a daughter, a sister and all that come with that, and how you can talk about that experience as well. I think I want to start out with something that's related to parenting and then Apshita is going to have stories for us today too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I want to kind of bring a situation that I had with my eldest daughter and which kind of surprised me, not really because she's just very like, she's very introverted, but she kind of like thinks like an um adult sometimes with, and she'll say certain things I'm just like, wow, where did you get that from, you know? So the other day she comes and then she's like, because I give her like an allowance and I usually give her like five dollars or whatever, and at the madrasa she goes to they can buy like honey, bun or whatever for like a dollar. So then she brings me four dollars back and she's like, you know, mommy, like I want you to have these four dollars and put it in your. You can put it in your account or like money jar or whatever, because I don't want you to work too much. And here's the money, as you know, in return.
Speaker 1:So that hit me because you know I'm only a point six at the hospital, I don't really work that much, but I'm always like in this like shuffling stage because I also manage my own business with my husband. And it surprised me because kids, you know, they're kind of in tune with these things and they recognize and they observe a lot of day-to-day things that you do, and so it's really important for you as a parent to reflect on that things that you do, and so it's really important for you as a parent to reflect on that uh, so it does not and how that translate into your parenting styles with them as well. So I thought that was interesting. What do you guys think about that?
Speaker 3:so I think that means that like for you in your head, right, like you're like oh, I'm just a point six, I'm not working that much yeah, I'm not like you know I'm getting time for my family. But I think she still sees it like oh, I want. That says she wants more of me. Yeah, that says a lot about your parenting, like she wants more of you in the house you know, because she yeah, that makes sense, that makes sense yeah, I think a lot of time our own.
Speaker 2:I'm going to go back a little bit because I think previous season we talked about parenting, that our own experiences from our parents and when we were raised, like like, I want to kind of go back to your daughter experiences because I remember myself also being worrying about looking for quality time for my mom and noticing how hard she works and noticing how much she provide. And I think sometimes, even as an adult today, the scarcity mindset about money for me comes from not seeing my mom that often and also working as hard as she did and try to provide for me. But in the midst of that I'm supposed to be grateful for the fact that she's trying to provide that and I can see why. And sometimes we also forget as a parent and that we don't notice this subtle things that our kids picks up right, and sometimes people would say like you know, kids don't know anything. But I always say kids are the most smart, emotionally intelligent I wouldn't say the creature, but individually they're so smart right, no, they, yeah, my kids.
Speaker 1:they like surprise me every day. And I think, as somebody trying to parent in the 21st century, you almost sometimes I find myself kind of questioning literally everything that I do. Because you're like, ok, I'm reading all these books on parenting, you don't want to emotionally damage them, you don't want to, you know. And then at some point you're just like, okay, what is the right way to do it? And you know, if you are trying to do a growth mindset and, you know, trying to instill certain values into your kids, um, how would you navigate that?
Speaker 2:you would say I mean, I'm curious to ask you mothers, right like I want to hear from you guys. What does it look like to raise children from emotionally resilient one stress resilient and have a growth mindset around that? What does that look like for you as a parent and specifically related to how you were also raised? Those are two questions. I'm curious how you guys navigate that. Do you think about that or is that part of your parenting style that you're trying to implement?
Speaker 3:yeah, I mean personally for me I think about it all the time depend with everything that we, I do because, um, I call my kids like the great experiment, because I'm not parenting from a space of experience, like I don't want to parent them the way I've been parented, um, and then I'm also taking, like you know, like I'm sure I said, like reading these books, watching these videos, watching these lectures, you know all of these things and taking stuff from my, uh, personal experience, from my parents, that I saw, that I liked, and not like you know, make and make sure I'm omitting things that I didn't like, so adding all of these things in a pot and trying to serve it up in a way that is beneficial to them and gets them the best.
Speaker 3:You know outcome and then also you know, with that comes big fear.
Speaker 3:Right like you don't get the response when you when you create like, for example, I grew, grew up in a, in a family that we, we, we got hit and you know the discipline was that we were, we got hit and we got contundas and we got, you know, whatever, whatever, and we were very much afraid of our parents and I grew up back home in the sense that that wasn't considered abuse. It's not In my head. It's not abuse, it's more of that's how parents parent back home, that's how parents discipline back home and for me, and for a very long time I still I believed that that was like you need to and I still do. There's an aspect of fear children need to have of their parents because that guides them and keeps them. You know, when the loving way the carrot doesn't work, the stick needs to work, not metaphorically, you know, but I feel like now I am learning that like, okay, how much space is too much right? How much space is enough? How much you know and like being able to be stern? But how stern can I be right? How loving can I be without making them, turning them into brats? How you know, how much can I provide?
Speaker 3:And even the idea of scarcity mindset right, like I was reading this book a couple of years ago, called um rich dad, poor dad, and he was talking about the fact that, like the difference between rich people and poor people poor people and how they parent their, their children is that is, that poor parents tend to poor meaning. Like he was talking about middle school, middle class families. They teach their kids like we can't afford that or we can't get that because we don't have enough money for that, versus how rich parent their kids would like we can. How do you want to get how? What do we have to do to get that thing you know more of like action-based versus like a stagnant? I can't so like stuff like that.
Speaker 3:And then also I was watching a video about um, how, how kids, if your kids are willing and feel safe enough to say no to you, or if they feel safe enough and if they are okay to have their emotions outright in front of you, like my, my son was like mom, um, I think you're being very rude right now. You're not listening to me. I'm trying to talk to you and I was talking to his dad and he was talking to me and I kind of had like he was just going here and he was probably asking me the same thing 10 times that I've already answered and he literally stopped me and he said mama, I think you're being rude, you're not listening to me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think that's that's the catch, right?
Speaker 1:Yeah, is that like and I've also had grown up with parents that are very like, you know, authoritarian and kind of like, expected certain things and stuff like that, and now, like trying to parent from a space of you expected certain things and stuff like that and now like trying to parent from a space of you know, um, growth and and stuff like that you, you can, in theory, um, cause, okay, earlier, I said, you know, reading all these books and stuff like that, when I try to apply these certain things, I think I apply it to a space where it gets comfortable. Certain things, I think I apply it to a space where it gets comfortable, you know. And so when they do push back on me, or when they, when they're like, oh, you know, um, and kids are really good at catching you in your lie, you know, as soon as inconsistency, yeah, and so as soon as they catch me and they're like, well, that's not what you told me last time, I automatically revert back to the parenting that I see, just shut up.
Speaker 1:You know, and I think for a long time, like with my eldest, we've been kind of going back and forth where, like I want her and I realize and I've talked to my husband about this I'm like, well, I think she's like sensitive.
Speaker 2:And you know and it translates that, and how she relates to other kids and other students as well, and I think I've kind of mentioned on previous episodes. But now when she does push back on me and she, my niece and nephew, is that when they first came, my sister's kids, when they first came to the US, I raised them based on fear, fear of overly protective and very mindful of like I wanted to kind of continue the generational parenting style that was taught to me, wanted to kind of continue the generational parenting style that was taught to me and I felt that was appropriate to go about that. And as I was doing that, recently, in the past five years, I recognized fear that I was parenting them from. Is that not trusting the process of their own skills and how they can grow in this society? And so I go around apologizing to my older niece and nephew that I said I recognize that I've been really parenting you guys from a fear place and so I'm really sorry about that because I didn't know how else I could do it differently. And I also raised you guys from the things that I didn't have, the things that I wish I could have had, the type of emotional availability from people in my life. So I parented you guys based on those skills that I had.
Speaker 2:And then I told the girls the girls are, mashallah, always so kind, but they will say you know what, don't worry about it, it's okay. And then the boy said something to me. He said yeah, you're right, you are very strict. You are very like strict. And then I went into defend mode where, like this is why I was strict Right now, although I went there to apologize, I'm still defending myself in the process and then I told him you know, you're right, I was strict. My strict is not an excuse for how I parented you, but I just wanted to kind of us talking about what that looked like for us, and because I parented you based on how my mom parented me, how my society was parenting me as a parent. Today, is there a moment, while you are kind of raising this an amazing, adorable kids, that you can see yourself, or you can see your mother in yourself, the way you go about it, and you're like wait a minute, that sounds like my mom.
Speaker 2:Yeah I shouldn't have even said that like that. Yeah, yeah, what would that look like? Give us an example or experiences that you guys went through with that.
Speaker 3:Oh, you want to go? Yeah, you can. You can go. Oh, for me, specifically, like when I was pregnant with my son my oldest one I kind of was like having a panic attack because I was scared that I would. Because, for me, being strict is good, like I don't think there's anything wrong with being strict, especially in the world that we live in today. I was worried that I was going to ruin or spoil him from a space of fear in the sense that, like, I'm probably going to give this child too much and and and they're not gonna have any because, again, like I came from back home, I was a refugee. I lost my parents when I was young.
Speaker 3:So, like all this shit that I went through, that made, built my character and was able to, I I use as, like, my armor this child I hope for. You know, I pray every day that they he doesn't have to go through it and that's not how he builds, or they build, um, yeah, their armor right. So I'm like, okay, but I don't have any other skills and I don't have any other tools to help them build that armor right. So I'm like, okay, but I don't have any other skills, I don't have any other tools to help them build that armor to go and face the world. I want them to be compassionate, I want them to be kind on all of these things. So I was worried that I'm also one going to be like, oh you know, I'm going to be emotionally available, I'm going to be, I'm going to give them everything that I never had and I'm going to spoil these kids rotten. So the first thing I did was get a therapist. I was like I cannot parent from a space of fear, a space of nostalgia, because when you look at your past, you tend to look through rose-colored glasses.
Speaker 3:So if I tell any parents what I would tell them is that make sure you got your stuff figured out. Why do you parent the way you do? What do you like about the way you were parented do? What do you like about the way you were parented? What didn't you like about the way you were parented?
Speaker 3:I really had to do a lot of inventory right, and then I had to be like okay, why do you think this worked for you and why didn't this work for you? You know now that you look at yourself in hindsight because nobody knows your past self like you do now, right, you have all the different. You know, hindsight is 2020, so and then, by analyzing that, okay, my parents maybe didn't realize the fact that I was a sensitive child. Maybe they didn't realize I had a fire in my belly, that that like came out as like, maybe, um, rebellious, but it was just that it needed to get challenged, uh, channeled a certain way, you know, or whatever the case might be right. So, being able to be like, okay, when my child like presents these things, like my daughter, alhamdulillah, she is fire, she is I know, if I cultivate that, she's going to set the world ablaze in the best way possible.
Speaker 3:I feel it and I don't, but then that's really hard to parent, because that's not like a yes ma'am, no ma'am, like okay, I'll do this for you, like that's not that yes, and I don't want to kill it, so I have to learn how to like yes the reason why that it is hard to parent because we were not skilled to be that type of child.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're not skilled to be challenged, yeah, or to be the child, like that who's able to, because we are parent based on like, um, like, following orders yeah, right, very authoritative, yeah, yes or no, and never argue yeah, we knew exactly, yes, yeah, yeah. So it's like when your child is being so fully like herself and joyfully and being assertive, being direct and being able to set boundaries so loudly, you're like whoa, what is that?
Speaker 3:yeah, and you also have to understand sorry, I don't mean to cut you off, but like you also have to take into play that you, she, has to be able to channel it, maintain it and then create healthy ways of expressing it without coming off abrasive to others. Right, yes, but that's later, though.
Speaker 2:The thing is that that's later, yeah, when she does do that, but also Hold on. When she does do that, right. When she's doing it in the midst of it, you let it be, right In the midst of it, you let it be, and then the same later, maybe in the evening, in the midst of it, you let it be, and then the same later, maybe in the evening. If she's doing that in the morning, you don't go. When she's in the middle of it, when she calms down and she's regulated, we come by and say you know, honey, I think the way you are feeling this morning makes sense. You are feeling a lot of big feelings. I don't think that's how we should be doing, and this is how we should do it, because I think for us, what I'm trying to get at is that our parents try to discipline us while we're trying to experience our own emotion, while we're trying to understand what we're feeling.
Speaker 2:First of all we don't understand what we're feeling and they're trying to discipline us at the same time as you're feeling it, those emotions. So, like, what I'm saying is that let the child feel what she feels and then come back and guide them through that.
Speaker 2:How to be with that instead of ran away because this is this is the more like I'm saying this from my expert point of view what actually works, because there is a level to it the way emotional regulation for children works. So in our culture, in our community, when the child does something let's say she breaks a glass in the room right, we come in the room and say why did you do that, why didn't you do the da-da-da-da? But you're starting with the question why they can't process why, even as an adult, the brain doesn't answer why yet?
Speaker 2:Are you okay? Is there anything I can do to help? Can you help me clean up? First, the body has to feel safe in order for the brain to answer the question. Yeah, what I'm learning as an aunt and as an also professional in this, in this child raising area feels is to like wait, the reasoning is not available yet. Yeah, the body feels danger. Yeah, when something is wrong.
Speaker 3:Yeah, right well, right, well, can I stop? Can I just add a little bit, because that danger aspect, right, yes, I feel like Ahon, for example, just in reality aspect. I think there's two things that I loved about what you said that I agree with, and I just want to add a little bit of amendment to two things, do you mind?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Okay. So what I was going to say was that, yes, coming back is great, but when you are dealing with someone that is under five or you know, like for example with yusuf with, who's five years old right now, that works fine. I can come back to him in a couple of hours and then, like, have that conversation and he's totally like remembers and recalls and he understands, like, he he's calmed down and regulated with nafi, who's three years old. Right for me, it's, for her, it's about one. Okay, you're valid. Okay, feel your feelings right now.
Speaker 3:Like, let me hold you, let me feel it, make you feel comfortable to feel your feelings and then, once she's because they go like this and they go like this really fast so when she's there yeah, right, in that moment you have to be able to be like okay, I totally understand why you felt the way you do in that moment, not coming back, because then she'll forget, she doesn't know what you're talking about right now or in a day later, whatever so she'll be in the moment you, after she's come back, you're like okay, I understand why you felt the way you felt. I understand you're feeling this way and you're right, it's okay, but can we do it this way?
Speaker 1:yeah for her. You understand with the age difference.
Speaker 3:Yeah it, I noticed that. That's very important. I think you guys are saying the same thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm just talking the amendment is about the timeline for me for that, but the timeline is up to you as a parent, right. I don't have a specific timeline in my head.
Speaker 1:I'm just saying that. But no, I think she's saying not in the moment in the.
Speaker 3:Moment of when when the glass is broken yeah, yes, and then that's also what I was talking about, what I was going to say. My second point with the, with the danger aspect that I wanted to point out, is that, like sometimes parents, because the, when you, when they hear danger right, like, for example, with yusuf actually today, what is going on back off?
Speaker 2:oh sorry, we keep going, so the danger was with with yusuf.
Speaker 3:He had dumped a plant that had soil onto the carpet and he came. He, because in our house there's a rule which is if you tell me the truth, you won't get in trouble. We'll talk about it, but it won't get in trouble. Yeah, so he literally called me from the kitchen. He's like mommy, I have to show you something that I did in your office. And then he's like look, there's a you know soil on the ground and I fell by accident.
Speaker 3:And I said okay can you get the you know like little vacuum thing and then like, let's clean it up? And then because that means that there is a previous conversation that has taken place there to a point to avoid that danger. There was no danger for him in there. What he needed, what he knew and he understood was that the danger comes if I broke this rule, which is if I lie right if I come and I tell my mom she's gonna know, like she's gonna help me figure it out, and I that is not built.
Speaker 3:and like rome is not built in a day, yeah, it's throughout his growth. That's the conversation. Is that okay? They get scared, us kids, when they break something right, and I will. Yeah, you have to be like no, it's okay. It's okay that you broke it, but let's clean it up and let's talk about it. Then, even if they're five, even Nafi, that's the same thing for her. It's the same thing for her. It's that she understands. If she tells me, no problem If they hide it, there's a problem.
Speaker 1:I will say that it's easier said than done, though I think that, as a parent say, when the glass breaks, you have two options. Right, you can be like what, what did you do? Blah, blah, blah. Or you can take a step back and think about it and be like okay, worst case scenario, what's the value of that glass? You know you would rather just take a moment, talk to them, be like, let's talk about it.
Speaker 1:I do want to highlight the lying aspect of it too. You know, kids only lie when they know that they're going to get in trouble for what they did. You know and I've kind of experimented this is that my kids, when, when they're like, okay, you know they've broken something and you know they don't want to get me upset, or they think they're going to make me mad or whatever, then they'll be like no, no, no, I didn't, I didn't do it, or whatever. So what I've started to do is to be like okay, yeah, the glass broke, it's fine, you know, know. And so Fatou, who is like four, she'd be like mommy, you know, mommy, I broke the glass and stuff like that. So now we've done this multiple times or she'll, she'll do something wrong and she'll. And then I'll ask them who did it, even though I've seen him do it, and they'll be like, oh, fatou did it, or my youngest, who's like two, I'll be like who did it? And then he'll be like Binu did it.
Speaker 1:So kind of reinforcing this, like like Binu did it, so kind of reinforcing this like You're safe, that you're safe and you don't have to lie about what you did.
Speaker 3:And I think that also comes back because I feel like most of the time and it's like I said, this is also like you said, it's easier said than done is that you have to and I think ASEAN, I think season one or season two said this you have to parent from a space of purpose, like what, every single interaction that you have? You have only 10 summers, right, you have only whatever like before, they are just either ignoring you, they've set their ways, whatever, so you have to. Every single interaction has to be set with this, with purpose, like you can literally go off about that cup, but in the long run, how? How important is that cup? You could use that opportunity, if you're parenting from a space of purpose, to make it a teaching, teachable moment. Yeah, right, to build a bridge, to build trust, to build comfort, and I think that's and it's also I totally understand and sympathize with parents that are moving in a space of light, right, like and at the speed of light, which is like I need to get done, I need to move, I need to like, be able to.
Speaker 3:I have work to do, I have dinner to cook, I have children that I need to, and I can't sit there and emotionally regulate with you 24 7, every time you're having a moment. They might have kids, but you but yeah, yeah. So being able, I totally sympathize with that. But then, taking a step back, you do everything you do as a parent for your kids. You go to work and work 16 hours for your kids, but what is that for if you're damaging your kids when you're at home?
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know what I mean, and I think it's also shifting their mindset too when it comes to work and why we work and stuff like that. But I kind of want to go back to because we keep mentioning this growth mindset, growth aspect, and I want you to kind of define that.
Speaker 2:Before I do that, I have a question for you guys. So what did in that case? Since we're talking about parenting that way, there, right, when it comes to disciplines and stuff like that, what does it mean for a parent to be emotionally regulated? For you two, I think, for me, like to be emotionally regulated for you to deal.
Speaker 1:I think for me, like to be emotionally regulated is to deal and go through your own issues first, you know, because I think that what if you have so much baggage that you have not even unpacked and stuff like that? And I don't, I don't think as a human being you're ever fully unpacked and fully working through all of your issues. But to take a moment, whether it's with a therapist, whether it's with your spouse, to talk to them, because some days are a lot harder than others For me personally. I have some days where I'm going 50 miles an hour, I've got, I'm working, I'm working on my business, I'm working on so many different projects that I'm proud of and all that, and sometimes it might feel like I'm not giving them my 100 percent, and in those days you know I might have a shorter fuse or might, you know, snap or whatever. But just taking a moment and really self-reflecting, I think helps overall.
Speaker 3:In addition to that, I think one thing, as people like real life because we're not just parents, right, we're human beings that are dealing with like real life situations One thing that we need to do, and we need to make sure that we do, is that our kids are not the place in any way, shape or form to let our emotions unchecked right, meaning that, like let's going back to that minute example of a glass being broken you are upset. Maybe that glass cost you, maybe someone gave you a gift, maybe whatever it's important to you, but and then you're feeling a lot of feelings and it's valid, but your kids are not the space, they're not the, they're not, um, old enough to be able to be the receiving end, at the receiving end of all of that. So you have to be like okay, because, think about it, if that glass broke, or if it was your boss that did that to you at work or something you know, whatever, if it was a stranger, you won't go off. There is that control factor, there's always a control factor. Implement that, implement that with your kids.
Speaker 3:Go to vent to your husband or your wife or your friend or your aunt, whatever, but then with them you have to be able to be, there's a needs to be a moment of like, decorum and professionalism and, like you, being a parent is work, yeah, and so you have to show up to work and check your emotions and your baggage at the door, you know, because, just like you do when you walk into work and I say that because but I also don't think it depends on the age the kid is at too, because, like, if I'm dealing with my two year old or my three year, my four-year-old or whatever, I might not like show emotion and stuff like that, but I feel like as kids get older, it's important for them to see you work through your emotions in a healthy way.
Speaker 3:And I want to also say this, because you just reminded me of something I say with my kids mommy's really frustrated right now. So they understand, I also get upset, I also get frustrated. So you know what yusuf and nafi did to me we'll lie, we'll be like. So I'm like I'm upset and I am this. This is like um, they done, they did something.
Speaker 3:And I've told them 10 million times and and and I'm like yusuf, I'm not yelling, I'm just right there. You know, like my buttons, it's kind of stuck to like go. So I'm like, you know, I like my buttons kind of stuck to like go. So I'm like you know we've talked about this, you're not supposed to do this. And then they're like mommy, okay, when we get frustrated, what do we do? Okay, I can, I can do it with you.
Speaker 3:Wallahi wa billahi, yusuf, he does that with me. He's like I'll do it with you. And I'm like what do we do? It's like, okay, take a deep breath. Take a deep breath, mommy, because you're getting really frustrated right now. So take a deep breath and I'm like okay, cool, I, I have to abide by that, because I can't say do as I. I say not as I do, right. So like having that, also like it's like you said, it's very, very important to be able to be human. But so they know that you get upset, you get angry. It's not only them, but you also say, you also practice what you preach yeah, you also breathe through it you also walk away from it.
Speaker 3:You also, whatever the case is right um, that's that. Those are very important and I think that builds relationships with each other what about like make?
Speaker 1:so now our kids are young, right I? And I have these thoughts all the time that how do I prepare them for a society that we're living in that is vastly changing, like you know, whether that it would be helpful for you guys to talk about the moment that you felt you dysregulated and how you handle that situation.
Speaker 2:So I think that would be really helpful to be relatable to that. I think we're kind of talking about hypothetically what it looks like. Yeah, I want us to dive deeper, like what is, what does it mean for me to feel dysregulated, what makes me dysregulated? And, and if I am dysregulated, how do I show up in my house? Yeah, I want you guys to talk about that a little bit more oh, so not what you okay before that before that yeah when I am dysregulated, how do I show up in my house?
Speaker 3:um, like I said, if it's coming to that point of frustration and they can see it, I have to verbalize it and be like hey, mommy's getting really frustrated.
Speaker 3:I'm gonna go upstairs that you felt that way specifically recently in the past maybe three days, Usually enough, you wrote with a Sharpie, permanent Sharpie, all over my laptop and that was I was like it was really. You know, it was my and that's the laptop I take to, you know, work, school, whatever, and they literally can't wipe it off. So and the literally you can't wipe it off in a so and the inside or the outside, the outside, so, like if I'm walking around, it looks like there's like a whole artist put a cover on it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like literally and so I had to photography. Yeah, yeah, it literally looks like a graffiti on my laptop, except you know a three-year-old and a five-year-old did it.
Speaker 3:So that was you know, and um, so I had to be like. I literally had to remove myself because I had to say okay, this is I. How many times did we talk about not using sharpies? And where are you allowed to use a sharpie? Because my, our first. Did you use it in that tone of voice? Yes, okay, or was it louder? No, so when there are moments when I do, I'm not gonna lie that I do get loud, okay, but most of the time when it is um, actually, I learned this from my uncle. He used to say um, if you emphasize the wrong things, like, for example, when I was young, my aunt used to like the heart tone I brought everything was the same. If you didn't wash the dishes, it's the whole hell is, the house is going to hell. And then if you do something extremely bad, that's the same. So then you can't tell the difference.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean.
Speaker 3:So I had to be like okay, and when I, when I know this is like super serious, I have to make sure, like okay, I have, you have to understand, this is not great, this is you've crossed some sort of line. So, like you know, Yusuf, you know, and I'm like very, my face is there, my tone is there, my volume is a little bit up With a little kunduta Maybe. No, actually, no, actually that's not true. If they break, if they, if it's an accident or if they do something, I normally don't go for kunduta.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Normally, kunduta is reserved for, which is a pinch yeah, that is reserved for like that.
Speaker 3:I have a very strong feeling about that. Okay, yes, I need your immediate attention because I need you to remember this. Like, for example, yusuf and nafi were playing so we don't have candles in my house anymore because they were playing around candle and you know, they, they I don't know what they were trying to do, but like the candle fell and like, so we had, like I have a big cute table that has like a bird on it. So that is something I need you to understand to never, ever do again so there's two situation.
Speaker 2:There's a situation of the computer have sharpie and there's a candle. There's a candle. So how do you?
Speaker 3:that's a safety situation like or you left the garage door open and he walked out, you know, so that's a safety situation. Or Yusuf left the garage door open and he walked out, so that's a safety thing for me. So I need you to have an emotional remembrance to like don't ever do that.
Speaker 2:And I think but that's you Okay. So in that sense what I'm hearing right, you are afraid of. Something bad happened to your kid in both ways.
Speaker 3:That's going to affect it to them.
Speaker 2:To them and the house and the situation itself. Forget the house. Yeah, so you are afraid of what's going to happen to them because out of danger? Yes, that's going to happen to them. I think your question is your reaction to that was I want him to remember that they will never do that again? Yes, but that for me, what I hear that is sandwiching with anxiety that you're building in their system.
Speaker 3:No, I think it's very close. Think about it.
Speaker 2:Because you're afraid. Yes, and that is something dangerous that kids do yes, and your reaction to that I want you to remember so you don't do it again.
Speaker 3:Yes, but I'm not doing it for the sake of my anxiety or my sake of fear. It's more about but are you aware of it? Yes, because, and also because you guys know, maybe if you guys listen to my season one and season two talk conversations about like contudas, I'm very I used to be very, very pro, like I used to be.
Speaker 1:Season one was like like a year ago no, not really, that's two years ago it's not that I'm not anymore, it's I'm in a different space there's growth, growth mindset so at that time I feel like, oh, you know my idea of because, also, I'm getting to know my kids more.
Speaker 3:They're growing, they're having personalities. It's not about just I learned better and now I'm doing better. It's not that. It's like I know Yusuf responds more to conversation and he responds to more of like being eye level and having that than me like being on top and and you know, like having some sort of authority over him, so I have to respect and, like it has, I have to conform to what works for that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Adjusting your yeah.
Speaker 3:And I'm not to, I'm, I'm, I'm not to. When I was there, I've been very clear about where I was there, like, oh, you know, don't touch your kids. Like a little it's okay for me, right, that's fine. But why are you doing that my, and then at home, for example, with yusuf specifically? I speak for yusuf because you know, like he's getting really, really mature and he's understanding and we can have a real conversation. He and I make sure he knows, like if that happens to him now, it's very it's real, like it's oh, okay, mommy, I'm so sorry, like he gets it, you know he like so, according to research, I'm going to be that person.
Speaker 2:Go ahead, please, and you guys are going to not like it. Yeah, according to research, this is something that I probably had to unlearn too. One form of the way anxiety is inducing children is one form of discipline.
Speaker 1:Okay. So then see, that's the problem I have with like reading, like digging deep, parenting talks or whatever, Like everybody's, like you should do it this way, you should do it this way, and I feel like, as a parent, it's inducing anxiety in me because I'm like okay.
Speaker 2:It's not about you, though I know, I know it's not about me but fundamentally, if it is about you, that's where you go outside of your support system to regulate yourself.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so fundamentally, I think my job as a parent is to raise a child that is well-rounded, raise a child that is well-rounded, that is able to handle situations that are stressful, that is able to participate in society in a positive and fruitful way. And I say that, and how I get there? I feel like every day is a battle and every day is like oh, something fat, yeah, something different, something that I have to um, tackle. There's, you know, always something that I'm I'm having to unlearn to think about, to be like cause at the end of the day, when I, when I sleep in bed and when I'm like thinking about how the day went. You know, there's certain situations like, oh, maybe I shouldn't have talked to her like that, maybe I shouldn't have, um, you know, compared them to like that, maybe I shouldn't have said oh, your sister did this or whatever.
Speaker 1:you know what I mean, because and we're going back to the aspect of you know, having your parents come out this was like 20 years or so of you hearing these things and and inevitably it will come out where you're like wow, I'm Apsharo, you sounded exactly like your mother today, I think can we also put a connotation to that?
Speaker 3:Because sometimes sounding like your mom is great In the sense that your mom putting that fear of God in you. Like I said, I know what the research says, but then, anecdotally, from the people that we've been surrounded around and the people that we grew up to be in, most of the time most of us grew up around the same parenting styles, right, and there, looking back, there are ways and there are reasons why you're like I'm so glad my mom did this. That's so true. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I agree with you guys.
Speaker 2:Yes you guys, yeah, so like, yes. So there's a way what I'm saying is like and I'm also working with people who was also born and raised here, like you guys, who work really hard and try to provide for their kids, and those kids are the one that's sitting in front of me telling me how that they did not, from their point of view, that they didn't receive a good level of support yeah, and I I'm not.
Speaker 3:I'm not discouraging that at all. I think that's totally valid. Like I said, I have aspects of my parenting that I'm like that was over the top, that was not necessary, that was not necessary. And then also sorry, I just don't want to lose my train of thought, go ahead. But then, at the same time, there are moments when I'm like I totally appreciate the fact that this person took these steps to stop me.
Speaker 3:Because now I am the way I am because of these decisions and because, like, I genuinely feel like I was more afraid of my family than they even knew, in the sense that, like I put boundaries up for myself in college and in you know whatever in high school that they didn't even put for me, in the sense because I was like I don't even want to get there. I want to put, like, let's say, for example, my curfew right. I don't think they even said, like your curfew is this time, but I told my friends that I had a curfew of like, unless it's weekend, 6pm and not 601. And my friend, or, like my, my family, family was. So I had to be home at 6 pm and my friends, if they wanted me there, if they liked me enough to to want me there, they had to have everything finished by 6 pm, you know, and before 6 pm so that I could get yeah, so then can two things can be true at the same time, then what are the two things?
Speaker 2:the fact that their experience of teaching you how to guide you in the world and how that affected you yeah, and I always wait.
Speaker 3:Hold on, can you explain?
Speaker 2:that a little bit. Let's say, for example, you're saying that there is caveat to the fact that how I was raised is beneficial for me in some ways. In some ways, and the respond to that, the emotional impact with that, yeah, yeah, but that's what I'm saying, that's where my like.
Speaker 3:So I'm taking that from that, putting, putting it into my parenting pot and I'm like, oh, this emotional thing wasn't there, so I'm going to put this there so that there's the best of both worlds. Does that make sense?
Speaker 1:I also take comfort, I guess, in that you know, like Islamically right, you have certain responsibilities and stuff like that the kids have on you and you have on your parents. Responsibilities and stuff like that are the kids have on you and you know you have on your parents, um, and so I take comfort in the fact that I can try to be a growth mindset parent. I can try, you know, not to do certain things but at the end of it, when my kids are grown and you know they have their own, uh, personalities, they, I feel like they come to that, not, I feel, yes, they they do come to that on their own as well, and and how you can help. You do take a percentage, but there are certain percentage of their personality too. That is just personality, okay, and you know, and there's this um so there's innately designed personality from allah.
Speaker 2:yes, that that they have. And then there's the things that I contribute.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. And so, for example, I was reading this story or I don't know, this person was saying that he had two sons. This guy and he was a smoker or he did like some bad things, or whatever. One son turned out completely different from his dad and they asked him you know, why did you take this route? And he said because my dad was that way. And then the other guy he went exactly what his dad did, and so they asked him you know, like, why did you take this route? And he said because my dad did. You know the guy, the father did one thing, but you have two different results as a result.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know so so is that part of the mindset that you're trying to provide for your child. The way that you're trying to raise is basically trying to provide how they can navigate in the world the best.
Speaker 1:I can the best way, yeah, the best way that I can, but without putting so much pressure on myself that I want my child to be this, you know, or whatever, and all that stuff yeah, and I think also communication is very key.
Speaker 3:I feel like you know I've always I always talk about, like my, my growing up back home. The one thing I really appreciated about my parents when I was back home is that I totally understood that we didn't have money.
Speaker 3:I also understood that, um, they were doing the best that they could so like if we didn't have money, I also understood that they were doing the best that they could so like if I didn't have like going to school with these rich people back home and I was the poor girl in that school, I felt like I didn't feel bad, that I didn't have the things that they did or the gadgets that they did and I wasn't picked up in a chauffeur. You know I didn't care. I mean, you're a kid, you know wasn't picked up in a chauffeur. You know I didn't care. Not, I mean, you're a kid, you know you notice, you pay attention, but you understand that like that's my parents act of love and the money that they have is going to give me a better future. And they had communicated that like hey, hey, sarah, like hey, bonnie, uh, we, you know we have this much money, this, you know, like not necessarily this much, but like you know, you, we are spending this much for you in the month.
Speaker 3:Look at our neighborhood. You know, like, where the kids go and look at where you go. You know this is more important for us to spend the money on. Yeah, so I totally. When I went there I knew what I was going in with. Of course, like I said, in the beginning, there was that there and now I know better and I do better, taking that aspect too, when I talk, communicate with my son and he literally was talking about we went to Marshall's and he was asking for toys. Right, and I don't want to get him the toy, not necessarily because we can afford that 15-20 dollar toy, but because he had enough at home. So, but I might. I was literally gonna come out of my mouth like mommy doesn't have money right now.
Speaker 3:We don't have money but then I literally rewinded it back and I said you know, um, we don't need it right now. When you need it, let me know. And he was like, oh, okay, because I was like you have. And I was pushing him and I was like, oh, you know, you have so many toys back. We remember the back the, the whole box of toys that you have that and you haven't. We don't play with them all. So when you need more toys, let me know. But we have toys, right, and that's intentional parenting that's intentional purposeful and holding yourself and understanding okay.
Speaker 3:So that's what I mean about like it's great to communicate, but then also I would say, like I would not have, I guess maybe, um, because there's that inferiority complex that comes when you know that others have and you don't right, and um and the overcompensation the overcompensation of it.
Speaker 3:So I feel like I don't know exactly what I would have done in that space, but, like in the space my parents were. But I really did appreciate that communication of like this is what we're doing, what we're doing, this is what you have, what you have, this is what you don't have, what you don't have, and when it comes to, like, even the punishment aspect of it, um, even when it comes to the punishment aspect of it, communicating, hey, sarah, I'm not, you know, giving you a kunduda. I'm not, you know, whatever because I don't like you or because you're a bad girl. It's because you did this thing. And you know, my mom always shook.
Speaker 3:I would get the whippings of life and then, after I was done crying, my mom would come in and she'd be like you know, we, you know, this is, this is the things that you did. I really want you to do better, and you know. So on and so forth. Yeah, so I understood it didn't come from a space of hate or I was a bad girl. I kind of thought, saw it like I did something not great versus.
Speaker 2:So what I'm getting out of our today's conversation is a couple of things right, there is level of space for involvement, for being a parent, because you're not where you were when you first started. And then there is level of kind of your own design of your own parent, that parent that you contribute to, sometimes, the way you parent. And then there's level of change. Right, there's some things that you believed on a couple of years ago as far as how you want to raise your kids and then understanding what is parenting from growth mindset is involved as balance. Right, because the whole purpose is like how can we balance the way that we're raising in a household Regulated, safe, connected and also being able to be assertive child in the world? And how would they be able to understand the emotional regulation for themselves and the emotional resiliency or stress resiliency as well? What does that look like for them? It's kind of talking about it with your kids inside the house, and so I kind of wanted to.
Speaker 1:I just want to say a couple things. Yes, go ahead. I just want to say that I do want to touch upon that, because we talked about how our parents parented us and how that's kind of affecting our parenting styles, and I want to recognize that that was a different time that they parented us and right now we are dealing with things that are happening in the community that maybe, you know, 10 years ago, 20 years ago, was not really as front and center, and I'm really excited for the rest of the season because all of these things that you know to mental health leads to problems in the community all stem from the home. You know whether it's neglect, whether it's parents not giving their time, you know their kids, you know their rights and in all these things, it all starts here, so you can go into, I guess can I add one?
Speaker 3:more yeah thing, I you know, just before we jump from the parenting aspect of it, you know there's two things that I wanted to add on to that. One is that parenting from a space we talked about, parenting from a space of growth, parenting from a space of fear, and but then also when I you know, when we mentioned about how, like, we have to take inventory of our own traumas, our own issues, to make sure that we are not imposing those on our kids right and making sure that, like we, like, if you are a people pleaser, why are you a people pleaser? Why do you not have, why do you have these porous boundaries? How can you help your kid create those? Like you can't do what you have, you, what you haven't seen being done, and the only way you know how to do that is by going after and taking inventory of the all the things that you, because like being introspective, and taking inventory of all the things that you feel like not necessarily are wrong with you, but are wrong with you.
Speaker 3:Or like, oh I, I have bad boundary skills. I have, you know, people pleasing tendencies. I have whatever a, b and c and d, whatever I have anger issues. Why is that? What about my parent? Like how I was parented, or my growing up, or whatever, what brought me here? I said at this age okay, how can? Now that I know this, what could have been done to stop that from happening?
Speaker 3:yeah, and making sure to do that yeah because otherwise your kids are going to be a carbon copy of you. They're going to have the same traumas that you do.
Speaker 1:Or you're going to pass out to them.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's generational, yeah so like people pleasers and we'll create people pleasers, anger people.
Speaker 2:You know, and so on, and so forth.
Speaker 3:So just making sure to take inventory of your own issues, get solutions for those so that when they show up in your kids, or when they show up when you interact with your kids, you have better tools to parent.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely, and as an, as an audience, if you ask yourself how do I do that, what can I do that, how all that kind of stuff comes up to you and I think that's a great question I usually lead with going to see in therapy, and I think that's also again I said this last season, I will say it again suggesting that is always a place of privilege and I wanted to acknowledge that. But there are podcasts, there are videos out there.
Speaker 1:There are books.
Speaker 2:There are communities of people on TikTok that actually talk about stuff like this, and I also am noticing a lot of Oromo young girls talking about their experiences on TikTok too, seeing a lot of Oromo young girls talking about their experiences on TikTok too, and it's okay to talk about the areas that we feel that there's not being, there's a void in it and kind of connecting to that.
Speaker 2:So this season we're going to have such an amazing conversation that is going to try to be a lot more difficult and complex and it's going to be a lot of uncomfortability for all of us because we're trying to push ourselves outside of our comfort zone.
Speaker 2:So we're going to be talking about the things that will be really well connected. So I want to encourage the listeners to reflect on what does it mean those parental styles looks like for you and what kind of mindset are you going into? How do you emotionally regulate yourself when you are kind of connecting to your kids and how do you create balance and create kids that are resilient and proud of themselves and so that way that they'll be able to not deal with a lot of the things that is really hard to even talk about. And also, I encourage you guys to kind of think about how do I create a safe space for my kids? Just make sure that you also talk about the things that's affecting you in a sense of like not digestible but comfortable ways that your kids are also can be related to you and see you as a human being, versus just this perfect parent as you shown to be.
Speaker 1:So any last thought, ladies, before we close today's amazing conversation, definitely looking forward to all the different topics and, yeah, looking forward to all the different topics and, you know, looking forward to having difficult, more difficult conversations yeah, last thing I would say is that make sure your kids are anchored in either in islam and their deen, or in their culture or both I feel like the best, the best um uh upbringings have strong anchors.
Speaker 2:That are bigger than their parents and bigger than their own personality.
Speaker 3:and those are those two things having Making sure your kids are dipped in their deen and dipped in their culture.
Speaker 1:And that's kind of like guardrails too, for you, which?
Speaker 2:helps. So thank you so much for listening. We'll see you on the next episode.
Speaker 3:This has been.
Speaker 2:Difficult Conversations.
Speaker 1:Join the conversation in the comment section or on our Instagram page to share with us what you think. We do not have all the answers and our biggest goal is to kick off and get the conversation going. May Allah accept our efforts and use us as catalysts for change.